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	<title>Comments on: Should I Get H1N1 Vaccine For My Kids?</title>
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	<link>http://www.four-pillars.ca/2009/11/04/should-i-get-h1n1-vaccine-for-my-kids-swine-flu/</link>
	<description>Investing and Personal Finance</description>
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		<title>By: AM</title>
		<link>http://www.four-pillars.ca/2009/11/04/should-i-get-h1n1-vaccine-for-my-kids-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-42599</link>
		<dc:creator>AM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 23:10:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.four-pillars.ca/?p=4552#comment-42599</guid>
		<description>Why is anyone talking about is not being cheap...its free!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why is anyone talking about is not being cheap&#8230;its free!</p>
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		<title>By: Shevy</title>
		<link>http://www.four-pillars.ca/2009/11/04/should-i-get-h1n1-vaccine-for-my-kids-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-42459</link>
		<dc:creator>Shevy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 18:01:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.four-pillars.ca/?p=4552#comment-42459</guid>
		<description>The clinic doc didn&#039;t do the test for H1N1.  He diagnosed flu and Tamiflu is helpful for either H1N1 or seasonal.  But there were children away with H1N1 at Dear Child&#039;s school, including at least one from her class and I had had the seasonal shot close to a week before getting sick.  It could have been that I just didn&#039;t have enough immunity yet and that I caught the seasonal but I don&#039;t know if it&#039;s possible to tell at this stage.  And it does seem at least somewhat more likely that it was H1N1.

It leaves me wondering if I should still go for the H1N1 shot now (assuming my doc has it again).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The clinic doc didn&#8217;t do the test for H1N1.  He diagnosed flu and Tamiflu is helpful for either H1N1 or seasonal.  But there were children away with H1N1 at Dear Child&#8217;s school, including at least one from her class and I had had the seasonal shot close to a week before getting sick.  It could have been that I just didn&#8217;t have enough immunity yet and that I caught the seasonal but I don&#8217;t know if it&#8217;s possible to tell at this stage.  And it does seem at least somewhat more likely that it was H1N1.</p>
<p>It leaves me wondering if I should still go for the H1N1 shot now (assuming my doc has it again).</p>
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		<title>By: Stompie</title>
		<link>http://www.four-pillars.ca/2009/11/04/should-i-get-h1n1-vaccine-for-my-kids-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-42361</link>
		<dc:creator>Stompie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 10:33:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.four-pillars.ca/?p=4552#comment-42361</guid>
		<description>Interesting stuff

Potato thanks for some facts and figures around the mercury issue. As a relatively new parent I still have a hard time accepting that this tiny person will have the same amount of toxic material injected into her, I guess you have to weigh in the benefits.

Shevy I&#039;m interested, did you actually get diagnosed with H1N1 then? I ask as I was the one lucky enough to bring something home two weeks ago and infected everyone at home. My wife and I were prescribed this tamiflu stuff but the little one wasn&#039;t and did take a lot longer to recover. It has left me wondering if we&#039;ve already had some exposure to H1N1 or if it was another random bug. Knowing could really make a non-issue of the vaccine issue for us but I have no idea if you just go to your doctor to be tested. He didn&#039;t seem interested when he was diagnosing and prescribing for us.

I would have thought if health organisations are trying to track the disease they would want to have tests on anyone who appeared to have the symptoms, although I do realise that would be a huge undertaking. Without knowing how many people have been exposed though how can we possibly keep track of the  statistical seriousness of the illness such as deaths/hospitalisations/infection ratios?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting stuff</p>
<p>Potato thanks for some facts and figures around the mercury issue. As a relatively new parent I still have a hard time accepting that this tiny person will have the same amount of toxic material injected into her, I guess you have to weigh in the benefits.</p>
<p>Shevy I&#8217;m interested, did you actually get diagnosed with H1N1 then? I ask as I was the one lucky enough to bring something home two weeks ago and infected everyone at home. My wife and I were prescribed this tamiflu stuff but the little one wasn&#8217;t and did take a lot longer to recover. It has left me wondering if we&#8217;ve already had some exposure to H1N1 or if it was another random bug. Knowing could really make a non-issue of the vaccine issue for us but I have no idea if you just go to your doctor to be tested. He didn&#8217;t seem interested when he was diagnosing and prescribing for us.</p>
<p>I would have thought if health organisations are trying to track the disease they would want to have tests on anyone who appeared to have the symptoms, although I do realise that would be a huge undertaking. Without knowing how many people have been exposed though how can we possibly keep track of the  statistical seriousness of the illness such as deaths/hospitalisations/infection ratios?</p>
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		<title>By: Shevy</title>
		<link>http://www.four-pillars.ca/2009/11/04/should-i-get-h1n1-vaccine-for-my-kids-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-42356</link>
		<dc:creator>Shevy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 08:47:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.four-pillars.ca/?p=4552#comment-42356</guid>
		<description>Well, I commented yesterday with my flu story on Mr. Cheap&#039;s post.  Basically, I&#039;m high risk (asthma, pneumonia history) and went to get the H1N1 but my doc only got *80* doses of it the first week and it was all gone the first day, before I could get in.   So I got the seasonal and was supposed to go back for the other.  Instead Dear Child came home from school on Friday feeling slightly unwell and was really sick the next night.  I was sick by Sunday morning.

We went to a walk in clinic Sunday evening and I was given Tamiflu.  Both of us are pretty much better (no fever for more than 24 hours, although we&#039;re both coughing) and I think we&#039;re going back to school &amp; work tomorrow since the &quot;no fever +1 day&quot; rule is the criteria for when to go back.

I&#039;m weak and still barely eating but I&#039;ve been much sicker with other flus in the past and much, much sicker the time I had Norwalk.  I was passing out on the bathroom floor that time in between bouts.  I have no clue how much to credit the Tamiflu for all this.

But I would definitely encourage people to get both the seasonal and the H1N1.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I commented yesterday with my flu story on Mr. Cheap&#8217;s post.  Basically, I&#8217;m high risk (asthma, pneumonia history) and went to get the H1N1 but my doc only got *80* doses of it the first week and it was all gone the first day, before I could get in.   So I got the seasonal and was supposed to go back for the other.  Instead Dear Child came home from school on Friday feeling slightly unwell and was really sick the next night.  I was sick by Sunday morning.</p>
<p>We went to a walk in clinic Sunday evening and I was given Tamiflu.  Both of us are pretty much better (no fever for more than 24 hours, although we&#8217;re both coughing) and I think we&#8217;re going back to school &amp; work tomorrow since the &#8220;no fever +1 day&#8221; rule is the criteria for when to go back.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m weak and still barely eating but I&#8217;ve been much sicker with other flus in the past and much, much sicker the time I had Norwalk.  I was passing out on the bathroom floor that time in between bouts.  I have no clue how much to credit the Tamiflu for all this.</p>
<p>But I would definitely encourage people to get both the seasonal and the H1N1.</p>
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		<title>By: Potato</title>
		<link>http://www.four-pillars.ca/2009/11/04/should-i-get-h1n1-vaccine-for-my-kids-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-42345</link>
		<dc:creator>Potato</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Nov 2009 05:10:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.four-pillars.ca/?p=4552#comment-42345</guid>
		<description>A small amount of thimerosal is in the vaccine we have (Arepanrix), other health units may be different (esp. the version in single-use pre-loaded syringes). From Health Canada:

The Arepanrix vaccine has &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/dhp-mps/prodpharma/legislation/interimorders-arretesurgence/prodinfo-vaccin-eng.php&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;2.5 micrograms organic mercury (Hg) per 0.5mL dose&lt;/a&gt;.

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/fn-an/pubs/mercur/merc_fish_poisson-eng.php#4.4&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Tuna can contain over 0.5 ppm of mercury&lt;/a&gt;, so 5  g of tuna would give you as much mercury as the shot -- about 1/30 of a can.

The vaccine in no way represents a medically significant dose of mercury, even for children. [I am obviously not a medical doctor, but anyone that seriously thinks a guy named Potato on the internet is dispensing medical advice has more money than brains if they come a-suin&#039;. Aren&#039;t disclaimers fun?]

As for waiting on more studies, unfortunately that&#039;s the nature of uncertainty: we have evidence in trials that the vaccine does stimulate the production of antibodies. We know from other vaccines prepared similarly that they tend to be safe and about 90+% effective. We can surmise that this one will be similar. But we won&#039;t be &lt;i&gt;certain&lt;/i&gt; of that until the opportunity for a timely vaccination program has long passed. Not being sure is not the same thing as not having a clue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A small amount of thimerosal is in the vaccine we have (Arepanrix), other health units may be different (esp. the version in single-use pre-loaded syringes). From Health Canada:</p>
<p>The Arepanrix vaccine has <a href="http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/dhp-mps/prodpharma/legislation/interimorders-arretesurgence/prodinfo-vaccin-eng.php" rel="nofollow">2.5 micrograms organic mercury (Hg) per 0.5mL dose</a>.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/fn-an/pubs/mercur/merc_fish_poisson-eng.php#4.4" rel="nofollow">Tuna can contain over 0.5 ppm of mercury</a>, so 5  g of tuna would give you as much mercury as the shot &#8212; about 1/30 of a can.</p>
<p>The vaccine in no way represents a medically significant dose of mercury, even for children. [I am obviously not a medical doctor, but anyone that seriously thinks a guy named Potato on the internet is dispensing medical advice has more money than brains if they come a-suin'. Aren't disclaimers fun?]</p>
<p>As for waiting on more studies, unfortunately that&#8217;s the nature of uncertainty: we have evidence in trials that the vaccine does stimulate the production of antibodies. We know from other vaccines prepared similarly that they tend to be safe and about 90+% effective. We can surmise that this one will be similar. But we won&#8217;t be <i>certain</i> of that until the opportunity for a timely vaccination program has long passed. Not being sure is not the same thing as not having a clue.</p>
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		<title>By: Dana</title>
		<link>http://www.four-pillars.ca/2009/11/04/should-i-get-h1n1-vaccine-for-my-kids-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-42064</link>
		<dc:creator>Dana</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 21:49:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.four-pillars.ca/?p=4552#comment-42064</guid>
		<description>Stompie:  Mercury is used in vaccines as a preservative.  I was told by a medical professional that there is no mercury in the H1N1 vaccine (one of the reasons the vaccine has a short shelf life).  Like you, I am aware of the issues around mercury, but I am not sure it is in this vaccine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stompie:  Mercury is used in vaccines as a preservative.  I was told by a medical professional that there is no mercury in the H1N1 vaccine (one of the reasons the vaccine has a short shelf life).  Like you, I am aware of the issues around mercury, but I am not sure it is in this vaccine.</p>
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		<title>By: Jess</title>
		<link>http://www.four-pillars.ca/2009/11/04/should-i-get-h1n1-vaccine-for-my-kids-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-42049</link>
		<dc:creator>Jess</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 21:29:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.four-pillars.ca/?p=4552#comment-42049</guid>
		<description>I survive from H1N1 twice by doing it naturally.  Last July 09 when I was at the North and Last week of Oct.  All I did was natural.   I recover fast even my kids age 10 and 7.    For simple reason, our body has its own antibodies.  All you need to do is give your body a weapon to fight against the viruses. You don’t go to war without a weapon! Second idea is to drink a lot of fluids so it washed it off.  3rd idea is to take a lot of rest.  You don’t want your body busy with other stuff while they should be fighting off the viruses. 

Here’s how I do it.  First Gargling with salt and 1 teaspoon apple cider vinegar will relieve the throat infection.    Eat a lot of veggies and fruits.  We most eat Papaya, kiwi, and grape fruit for Vitamin C.  Eat Chicken soup!   Mix Lemon, maple syrup, and Cayenne pepper and drink it early in the morning and 3 times a day.  For cough we apply Organic Apple Cider Vinegar two teaspoons every 2 to 4 hours.  Oregano oil for throat and cough.  Cut Ginger and suck it like a candy for hacking cough. We also take Coconut Virgin Oil for anti-viral.  Cut garlic for fever.  For supplements, we have multi vitamins, vitamin c 1000 mg.   I also added Vitamin B-complex, flax seed oil, omega 3-6-9, calcium magnesium for myself.   I double my supplement intake when I am sick.   We keep drinking tea with honey.

By doing this, it only last 1 to 2 days. You can do your own research by googling the benefits of each one of them such as lemon, garlic, ginger, coconut oil, cayenne pepper, apple cider vinegar, honey and so on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I survive from H1N1 twice by doing it naturally.  Last July 09 when I was at the North and Last week of Oct.  All I did was natural.   I recover fast even my kids age 10 and 7.    For simple reason, our body has its own antibodies.  All you need to do is give your body a weapon to fight against the viruses. You don’t go to war without a weapon! Second idea is to drink a lot of fluids so it washed it off.  3rd idea is to take a lot of rest.  You don’t want your body busy with other stuff while they should be fighting off the viruses. </p>
<p>Here’s how I do it.  First Gargling with salt and 1 teaspoon apple cider vinegar will relieve the throat infection.    Eat a lot of veggies and fruits.  We most eat Papaya, kiwi, and grape fruit for Vitamin C.  Eat Chicken soup!   Mix Lemon, maple syrup, and Cayenne pepper and drink it early in the morning and 3 times a day.  For cough we apply Organic Apple Cider Vinegar two teaspoons every 2 to 4 hours.  Oregano oil for throat and cough.  Cut Ginger and suck it like a candy for hacking cough. We also take Coconut Virgin Oil for anti-viral.  Cut garlic for fever.  For supplements, we have multi vitamins, vitamin c 1000 mg.   I also added Vitamin B-complex, flax seed oil, omega 3-6-9, calcium magnesium for myself.   I double my supplement intake when I am sick.   We keep drinking tea with honey.</p>
<p>By doing this, it only last 1 to 2 days. You can do your own research by googling the benefits of each one of them such as lemon, garlic, ginger, coconut oil, cayenne pepper, apple cider vinegar, honey and so on.</p>
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		<title>By: Four Pillars</title>
		<link>http://www.four-pillars.ca/2009/11/04/should-i-get-h1n1-vaccine-for-my-kids-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-42009</link>
		<dc:creator>Four Pillars</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:59:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.four-pillars.ca/?p=4552#comment-42009</guid>
		<description>Stompie - I&#039;m not sure how valid your concern about the mercury is.  If the amount given to the baby is small enough to be safe then the fact that you are getting the same amount is irrelevant.  

Just because a certain amount of mercury might be safer for you doesn&#039;t mean it&#039;s unsafe for the baby.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Stompie &#8211; I&#8217;m not sure how valid your concern about the mercury is.  If the amount given to the baby is small enough to be safe then the fact that you are getting the same amount is irrelevant.  </p>
<p>Just because a certain amount of mercury might be safer for you doesn&#8217;t mean it&#8217;s unsafe for the baby.</p>
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		<title>By: Stompie</title>
		<link>http://www.four-pillars.ca/2009/11/04/should-i-get-h1n1-vaccine-for-my-kids-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-41999</link>
		<dc:creator>Stompie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:32:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.four-pillars.ca/?p=4552#comment-41999</guid>
		<description>We taking the wait and see approach currently.

My main concerns are that from my reading (mainly CBC) it appears that 
1) My infant will get the same dose as I would which with the mercury seems excessive considering I have 7 times the body mass to deal with absorbing this toxic material. I realise sea food has mercury in it but she isn&#039;t eating that yet either
2) Their haven&#039;t been many studies on the effectiveness of the vaccine and the majority of the studies that have been done are for adults. It&#039;s suggested in the article below we won&#039;t know the effectiveness from the Canadian study until next year, so people are waiting in the cold for 6hrs for something we aren&#039;t sure is going to work. (Sounds like a good way to catch the flu)
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2009/10/20/h1n1-vaccine-clinical-trials-canada.html
3) It also seems like the &quot;experts&quot; are concerned about the lack of information for the non-typical adult test group.
http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2009/09/17/h1n1-vaccine-babies.html

I&#039;m not against this if it prevents people from dieing and I&#039;d love it if someone can correct anything I&#039;ve got wrong. It just seems like their is conflicting information and not enough research on the stuff I care about, which is my infant, to make an informed decision.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We taking the wait and see approach currently.</p>
<p>My main concerns are that from my reading (mainly CBC) it appears that<br />
1) My infant will get the same dose as I would which with the mercury seems excessive considering I have 7 times the body mass to deal with absorbing this toxic material. I realise sea food has mercury in it but she isn&#8217;t eating that yet either<br />
2) Their haven&#8217;t been many studies on the effectiveness of the vaccine and the majority of the studies that have been done are for adults. It&#8217;s suggested in the article below we won&#8217;t know the effectiveness from the Canadian study until next year, so people are waiting in the cold for 6hrs for something we aren&#8217;t sure is going to work. (Sounds like a good way to catch the flu)<br />
<a href="http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2009/10/20/h1n1-vaccine-clinical-trials-canada.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2009/10/20/h1n1-vaccine-clinical-trials-canada.html</a><br />
3) It also seems like the &#8220;experts&#8221; are concerned about the lack of information for the non-typical adult test group.<br />
<a href="http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2009/09/17/h1n1-vaccine-babies.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2009/09/17/h1n1-vaccine-babies.html</a></p>
<p>I&#8217;m not against this if it prevents people from dieing and I&#8217;d love it if someone can correct anything I&#8217;ve got wrong. It just seems like their is conflicting information and not enough research on the stuff I care about, which is my infant, to make an informed decision.</p>
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		<title>By: Jess</title>
		<link>http://www.four-pillars.ca/2009/11/04/should-i-get-h1n1-vaccine-for-my-kids-swine-flu/comment-page-1/#comment-41984</link>
		<dc:creator>Jess</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 19:06:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.four-pillars.ca/?p=4552#comment-41984</guid>
		<description>CBSNews disturbing findings that seasonal flu shot are made more susceptible to H1N1 swine flu

http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2009/09/23/flu-shots-h1n1-seasonal.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>CBSNews disturbing findings that seasonal flu shot are made more susceptible to H1N1 swine flu</p>
<p><a href="http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2009/09/23/flu-shots-h1n1-seasonal.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.cbc.ca/health/story/2009/09/23/flu-shots-h1n1-seasonal.html</a></p>
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